Episode 57 | Gabriel Hamel | Military Millionaire

00:00 - 05:00

David:

Hey, what's up guys? It's Dave. Today's episode is with Gabriel Hamel. And we're going to talk about how he went from the National Guard to building a real estate empire through seller financing and creative financing and just cutting the bank out of having to do his transactions.

Also, if you haven't done so already, go ahead and subscribe to this podcast so that you can see more of our episodes and so that you can tell iTunes or Spotify or Pandora or wherever you listen to this that you like the show and they will help us get more followers and more people in the community. Thank you very much. As always, show notes are found at Frommilitarytomillionaire.com/podcast. Now relax and enjoy the show.

Intro:

You're listening to the military millionaire podcast, a show about real estate investing for the working class. Stay tuned as we explore ways to help you improve your finances, build wealth through real estate and become a person that is worth knowing.

Sponsor:

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David:

Hey, what's up everybody? It's Dave and I'm here with Gabriel Hamel who did a little time in the garden and built an empire through seller financing and other creative means of investing. And super stoked to walk through this journey with you.

Gabriel, welcome to the show.

Gabriel:

Hey, happy to be here. Looking forward to..

David:

Yeah! We hung out this week at the BiggerPockets conference and we talked a little bit on Instagram. So just excited to get to sit and talk to you.

Tell us a little bit about yourself brother.

Gabriel:

Yeah. Well, when I was about 19, I read a book. Some of your guests may have read Rich Dad Poor Dad. And it changed direction. In fact, it was the first book I ever read, word for word cover to cover.

You know after high school, I wasn't sure what I was going to do. I had joined the Army National Guard, my senior year had gone to basic training, read this book, did some audit and jobs throughout after high school, but then I got deployed. And while I was deployed in O3 and O4 I thought about a lot of the lessons I learned in that book. And I was dead set. When I came back I was going to buy property.

So in 2005 I bought my first house. And I did the same thing in 2006-2007. And back then banks were given out financing. So I didn't have a job, didn't have income, but banks were giving out money. And so the first couple houses were no money down. One was a 5% down deal. And I was doing pretty good there. The property's cash flowed. And then 2008 hit and I went to the bank and they said hey, you need a job. You actually need a downpayment and income and so that's when I had to get started getting pretty creative and start doing seller financing deals. And so 2009, 10, 11, 12 is where I really started to build up my portfolio of seller financing.

David:

That's awesome.

So what uh, like what turns you on to seller financing? I mean, obviously, not being able to borrow money, but where do you hear about that a lot of people don't even know that's the thing.

05:00 - 10:00

Gabriel:

Yeah, you know, I didn't know a lot about it. And for me it kind of came out of necessity. So backing up a little bit. When I had those three houses, I also opened up a small nutrition store with a friend of mine that I was deployed with. And some months, some months, you know, I was only cash flow and a couple $100 a month. And so I'm standing in my store having these couple houses, they cash flowed a little bit and I'm thinking, I'm just doing the math. For me to really make a living, for me to really be able to live off my rental income. This traditional financing thing just isn't gonna fly.

As I'm thinking about my financial goals, my now wife gives me a call early in our relationship and says, Hey, I'm pregnant. So I'm going oh, my gosh, you know, like, obviously, I wouldn't change it for the world. But I had this goal to be financially free before I had kids. And so long story short, I shut the store down, took a bunch of odd jobs and I was just Craigslist stuff. And I ended up with a minimum wage job. I was also coaching High School wrestling, but I took a job in the special education class in that high school, about three months in clean and shit out of a stall that kid had thrown around in my in my heart goes out to these, you know, these kids, but that was not my not my dream job.

And so I set a goal, Hey, I have to replace this income. And with it being not a high paying job, it was an easier attainable goal to replace that income. So I just searched out, I was knocking on doors, I was making phone calls, I was just scouring Craigslist every day for a seller financing opportunity. And the first one that came along was for units. It was two duplexes side by side. And it cash flowed almost to the dollar, what I was making at that, at that job. And at that point, I finished out that year and I decided to stop working even though I wasn't wealthy, yet, I was able to replace that income with cash flowing properties. And now I had my time to go out and search for more.

So that was kind of the beginning of the beginning of that journey with seller finance. And it really came out of necessity of, hey, I need to make this work and create more cash flow than traditional finance is gonna give me.

David:

Yeah, and the fact that you didn't have like a huge w two income for banks. Yep, kind of forced your hand. But I'm a huge fan. I mean, I just refinanced my 10 unit last week, and in the refinance, I closed out all my seller financing and took cash on top of that. So I was able to pull my entire personal downpayment out, and also pay off all my seller financing and dropped my payment, like 200 bucks a month.

Gabriel:

Awesome.

David:

But I bought that thing at like four and a half percent down, everybody's like, how in the world? Do you buy a commercial property? I met a local lender. That was cool. And I asked the seller the right question. And I think that it's funny to me, because so many people don't ask the question about seller financing. They're like, Well, how do you find these deals? Like, well, people aren't just walking around usually saying, hey, I want to sell or finance my house. Do you? Do you have any secrets for how you bring that conversation up?

Gabriel:

Yeah, so it's interesting, my, all the seller financing deals I did in 2009, 10, 11, 12. These are all non listed properties. And so the sellers were typically men and women in their 60s and 70s. Really, really good people. They were just busy and tired landlords because they had jobs or their own businesses, and they'd owned the asset they own the properties for for some time, and they were just burnt out.

So a lot of the stuff I did then were non listed, and they were properties that were poorly managed under rented and deferred maintenance. And those are the things I was really looking for is where can I, if I can find a tired landlord, and there's value to be add, if I can create a scenario, that's a win for them and a win for me, it's an opportunity and so most sellers were stuck on down payment, interest rate or purchase price, but rarely, almost never all three. And so for me not having a huge down payment. I figured hey, if I could give them a price close to what they want, but with terms that work for me, it's a true win-win.

And so I was just having conversations with sellers and really just asking, I mean, you said it asking good questions, and then just shutting up and listening and seeing what they need. And if you can give them what they need and solve their problem. You can create an amazing deal for them. And for yourself. I mean, so many times I walk away from a closing I'm excited about buying it and the seller is thanking me for buying it from them. And it's a true win win.

David:

Yeah, and I love that you, like you said they're stuck on a down payment or monthly payment or an interest rate or whatever but not all three. So I'm in negotiations or I'm gonna jinx it by letting me knock on wood. I'm negotiating on a 12 unit right now and the guy is 76 self managed, clearly under market value, clearly an underperforming asset he wants out and I'm like talking to him. He's like I owe 20 grand on it. After that, He mentioned a number of it, he's like, that's really my biggest thing. So I'm like, Okay, great. So now I know, the target down payment, I just need to tweak, what he gets is a monthly payment and knowing the numbers on this property, I could probably just tell him, like, I'll give you 1000 bucks for the next 15 years. And he would be totally cool with zero interest and a monthly payment, cuz that would be more than what he's been pulling in because of how bad the management is on it.

10:00 - 15:00

Gabriel:

Yeah.

David:

And so it's really cool to be able to do that, because I would never get those kinds of terms on a commercial lender for a big multifamily. But it's also going to be helpful to him. Anyways, or tweak and final back and forth on that. But yeah, basically keep going back to, I'm going to be paying you more than your cash flow right now. And you won't have a headache.

Gabriel:

Well, that's the thing, like you nailed it, like you're able to tweak it and change it where you go to a bank and the banks telling you, hey, here's the terms, this is how much you need to bring in. This is the interest rate. You don't have a lot of say, I mean, some of the community banks, there's a little flexibility, but with seller financing, there's a lot of flexibility. What is it that they want? I mean, you can be pretty, pretty creative when it comes to that.

And I hear people say, hey, you can't do seller financing, right? You know, now because it's a, you know, a seller's market, and there's a lot of cash in the market. And sure, that's, that's the reality, and some, but there are sellers that want to carry the financing. There's a lot of people in their 60s and 70s that don't want a lump sum of cash, they don't want to pay that capital gain. And they're happier with just having that monthly income, possibly for the rest of their life, but at least for the next several years.

David:

Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, you hit the nail on the head, and we'll probably touch on how taxes work on that in a minute. But just for the audience's sake, do you have crazy terms? Like a favorite deal? You didn't great terms of terms?

Gabriel:

Gosh. Terms of terms.

You know, I think a lot of the deals I did early on, you know, they were infinite returns, because I was doing no money down. But I was strategically closing a couple days, a couple days into the month. And so a lot of times at closing, I would, I would collect the rent for that month, I would have the deposits, and I would have last month's rent.

So there were many instances where I was actually walking away from the table at closing with cash. Other times when I brought in small down payments, kind of the same deal where with deposits and prorated rents and such, it would end up being a wash, and I would end up having to bring nothing to the table.

Now not every deal was a no money down deal. But oftentimes it was lower money down because the seller is more interested in that monthly payment, and then we're the down payment.

David:

I really love what you just said there that some people may have missed with the strategic date, the fact that you can take the prorated rent and still not owe them a monthly payment till later on. And you'll come out, you'll start out on top. That's awesome.

Gabriel:

Yeah. And there's actually been some deals where I've deferred or not had a payment for even several months.

So a couple properties, where I knew there was a little bit of work I wanted to put in and it's just asking those questions like, hey, what if payment started three months after we close? What if they started six months after we closed? A bank would laugh at you but a seller? If there's a strong reason for that they might be okay with that. You just you never know.

David:

Yeah, absolutely.

And that's it. Like you said, That's huge, because you can structure all of that. And I've seen when you see interest only you see no interest.

Gabriel:

Yup!

David:

It's totally up to what you're willing to ask and they're willing to agree to.

Gabriel:

Yeah, you're exactly right.

I've done a lot of interest only with the seller financing, just so the payment would be lower and have that cash flow. There was one scenario where it was an interest only payment. But they agreed that $500 each month went directly towards principal.

So the structure of it, it was actually my payment was low, and I was knocking out the principal balance too. So there's just so many different things you can do.

David:

That's pretty cool.

Yeah, it's so so I know, we touched on the tax thing real quick. And I'll probably ask you to expound on that here. But what are some reasons that you found that people would be open to seller financing?

Gabriel:

Yeah, and I mean, I'm not a tax professional. But you know, my understanding is, you know, if you pay them off, and they get the lump sum of cash, they're paying a big capital gain on that. They still have to pay capital gains if you're paying them over time, but it's not a big lump sum. So they're able to pocket that money. And then, you know, the other part of that is a lot of these sellers. They don't want the cash. They're not necessarily complaining. But yes, they're gonna pay that tax bill that capital gain and now they have a cash problem. They need to put that money somewhere to give them a return.

A lot of these sellers, they're sophisticated enough to know hey, I just don't want a bunch of cash to live off, I actually want to return my money. You know, I have to still stick in the stock market at 60 and 70 years old, which is the age of a lot of these sellers. They don't want to stick their money in the stock market, they know that could disappear within their lifetime. And so I would say that's one of the biggest advantages is you're giving them an interest that they're happy with, they're not paying that huge capital gain up front. They're happy.

15:00 - 20:00

David:

That's very true. Or they've got my problem, which is if cash sits in a bank account, I will find somewhere to spend it.

Gabriel:

Absolutely.

David:

So I always keep my money. My wife hates how many bank accounts I have laying around. But it's like the profit first strategy. I read that book. And I was like, man, I subconsciously do this where I have like, this money goes to this bank, and then this money goes to this bank, and I don't even have an owner card for that bank. So like, don't touch...

Gabriel:

Deploy, deploy the money, deploy the money.

David:

Yeah, exactly. And if I'm going to be saving for an emergency fund, it's gotta be somewhere where I'm not going to see that the emergency fund has 10 grand in it, or I will deploy it somewhere.

Yeah, I think that's really cool. So definitely the tax thing. And then just the, like you said, like, What do you want with $40,000 or $100,000, sitting in a bank account when you could have somebody paying you that interest on your money for the next 30 years without you having to go invest it somewhere else?

Gabriel:

Yep. Exactly.

David:

That's really cool. Yeah, I love seller financing.

So I know, you're, you're a very driven individual, and you've done some other cool stuff in your life, we can touch on if we want to. But what is it that like, what's motivating you going forward now?

Gabriel:

Yeah, I mean, it's my family I have. I have two young kids, not well, they're not that young. Now. They're 9-11 and have an awesome wife. And so for me, I always want to be getting better, you know, in all areas. And to me, my family's important, my health is important. Building wealth is important. Contributing is important. And so I don't want to be stagnant. I want to push myself and all those in all those areas. I truly believe if we're not getting better, we're getting worse. And so I like to set goals. I like to make sure that the things I do align with those things, with my family, with my health, with my wealth, my happiness and contribution.

David:

Yeah, that's, that's super cool.

I was gonna joke earlier about the wrestling coach making sense, because for those of you who aren't watching this live, Gabriel's built like a tank. So it makes sense. Seems like wrestlers don't ever lose that.

Man, so many questions. What would you say? So like, if a young 18, 19, 20 year old was to walk up to you looking for advice, like what would be like the one thing you think you'd tell them going forward?

Gabriel:

I'd say, you know, early on, don't buy stupid things, you know, save your money. Now, I don't think saving wealth is difficult. But I think early on saving your money and the simpleness of starting to buy assets. Instead of liabilities. You know, there, you can buy a lot of doodads, you can buy a lot of things that are not going to go up in value from the age of 18 to 20, whatever or 30. And I think it's easy for people to get in the habit of just buying things and creating, you know, not real estate debt, but consumer debt. And so I think young people have an opportunity to just save a little bit of money, and then put that into a deal.

David:

Yeah, I agree.

I always try to tell servicemembers that, you know, there's this popular mentality that we don't make enough money and whatever. I would argue that for a lot of good reasons with people, but I tell them, you know, it's not your income that makes you wealthy, that helps. But it's your expenses. I know, we have people who make $500,000 as a surgeon and do not have financial independence.

Gabriel:

And that's and that's the whole thing, right there is I've met people that whether it's a minimum wage job or a high paying job, they make more, they spend more, they make more, they spend more. And I think that's why getting that in their head early on, no matter how much they, no matter how much they make. If your expenses always, always hit your income, and in some cases, people are always spending more than their income, it puts them in a tough spot. And then they have to work for money instead of letting their money work for them. So you can do a lot of damage in a decade if you're smart with your money.

David:

Oh, yeah. Yeah, I know, some young fours that are crushing it right now. And I'm like, dude, if you can just keep your expenses low, you'll be totally financially free within a few years, and it'll be super cool to watch.

Gabriel:

Yeah.

David:

So are you still in the single family seller financing realm or has your strategy shifted as time has gone on?

20:00 - 25:00

Gabriel:

Yeah, my portfolio is kind of a mix. So my first three houses were single family and then the early seller financing stuff for smaller multi, twos and threes, four sixes. And in 2014 I had refinanced out of all all my seller financing deals and and then I've kind of done a mix so I've I have mostly some smaller multifamily, some apartments I have some mixed use commercial residential stuff and more recently, earlier this year bought a mobile home park I backed out of a mobile home park that I was in contract on and I am now in contract on another Park and so but all you know all the properties I look at that they're all value add but I'm never relying on that value add to make to make the deal work.

So I really base everything on what the asset, what the property is currently doing. I make sure my financing fits what the property is actually doing. My Performa I never I never bank on my Performa. But I know my market. I know my sub market. And I usually hit that. So.

David:

Yeah, that's cool. And that's very, very good to hear a lot of people, the value add thing has become a I mean, obviously it's very important. But if it's not cash flowing, or at least gonna support itself, when you buy it. You're just asking for House of Cards.

Gabriel:

Yeah. And I mean, I can give you a ton of examples where, like an easy one, was I bought a six unit place last year where the rents were below market, they were each unit was like 625 a month or 650. market rent was closer to 1000. But I am still based. I know that market really well. I still based it on that 650 just in case I was wrong just in case something, something came up that I that I didn't know, I want to make sure the property still worked and I the eye closed on it and three people moved out and I was able to bump those three right up to the market and that was fortunate.

So yeah, there's something to be said about knowing your market but never bank it on Performa.

David:

Yeah, because you never know you may have. I closed by 10 and evicted two people within the first two months and then had someone I mean, you just never know I had someone die in it last month, which is great. My insurance companies are talking about whether they're going to pay for the crazy environmental cleaning, oh my goodness, like we're Missouri and they're charging. They're looking like 3800 bucks to do an environmental cleaning on my apartment building and I'm well it costs 10% of that to evict someone. So I can't imagine what that would cost in California.

Yeah, so that was definitely an unbudgeted for. I mean, granted, there's definitely cap x at everything, but I was planning on like, yeah, someone's gonna die in my apartment and just lay there for two weeks before someone realizes that. So yeah.

Gabriel:

People that always factor that one. Yeah.

David:

I mean, point being you're spot on, if it doesn't make money when you buy if I had bought that thing, and I was it negative cash flow, and that happened in the first month I took over, that would have been a very rough hurdle for starting out. So having those reserves and having it work when you buy. I think there's especially right now when it's, you know, kind of a seller's market, in a lot of places. There is a misconception with buyers where you have to pay what people are asking.

Gabriel:

Yep.

David:

And there are people asking. I mean, you see it all the time on performance, where they say, oh, it should read for this. So it's worth this much. Okay, great. Well, you know what, it should be read for that, but it's not. So why are you trying to get a price for something you fail to do as an owner? And that's a conversation you just need to have.

Gabriel:

Yeah, and I'm seeing it I mean, I have a lot of stuff coming across my desk that are being sent over by commercial brokers who have, they've underwritten and vetted the deal, but I'm gonna dig into that myself. And with the mobile home park that I purchased earlier this year, as I dug into the numbers, it got better and better.

So rents hadn't been increased in four and a half years, utilities weren't being billed back, you know, it was so it was under rented, there's some value add there, and the more I dug in, and some of the numbers were actually wrong in my favor. And so as I got into it, it was better and better the property that backed out but it was the opposite. They created this performer that actually looked really good. They took the highest month of rent, which as I got into it, was like the highest month of rent and three years probably probably more than that. And they showed the lowest expenses and as I got into that it was like wait a minute, only one month have you ever hit this rent every month your expenses are much higher vacancy is much higher. But the thing look beautiful on the Performa you know most people looking at this on paper going man, this is a good buy.

So it's important. It's important to dig into those numbers and really know.

David:

Yeah, you can find all that information well. Sometimes you really got to dig but through utilities reports and schedule ease and all this stuff and too often people look at performance they wow and they get star eyed.

25:00 - 30:00

David:

It's very rare that you see a pro forma that doesn't look better than it is.

Gabriel:

Yep. And trust your instincts, you know, math and trust your gut.

David:

Yeah, like this one I'm looking at right now that I mentioned earlier, the, it's, it's throwing me for a loop, the performance looks terrible. And I'm talking to the guy of like, there's no way like, it can't be this bad. Like, he's gotta be just really bad at bookkeeping.

So anyway, this is probably the first time I mean, I always like to have my property manager look at stuff. But this is probably the first time where I've been like, I am not writing you an offer. Until I see all of the information I would normally ask for in due diligence. Like, I'm not even playing the offer game because I don't even know where to come close on this thing. Yeah, the rent roll says this. And your pro forma says way worse your schedule even worse than that. And like, I don't know what you're doing with bookkeeping, but you're terrible at it cuz you're supposed to make this look better than it is. And you're going the wrong way.

Gabriel:

Yeah, that's how that's how the park was that I backed out. And it was like, same thing, nothing matched up.

David:

Yeah.

And you're like, there's no way this guy's underselling himself this much, but sometimes they just don't understand how to, you know how to make a property look good. Like, I think this guy is wrapping personal expenses into his p&l, which is great for me, because then I can be like, well, it says, you're only making this much. But.

Gabriel:

Yep,

I've seen that. I've seen that too. I'm like, wow, this property has a lot of travel expenses. I've even seen like, like, wow, they got a new car with this property. So that's not going to be an expense for me.

David:

Come with the house. That's funny.

Awesome.

So what advice would you want to give anyone? I guess not advice, we'll skip that we kind of asked a question like that already. I guess what I would say is some of the pitfalls that you see with seller financing. Are there any things you see people getting in trouble with?

Gabriel:

Um, you know, I've always structured it, where some sellers will carry for a long period of time, and some want a shorter period. And a lot of that is just building their trust and building relationships. But like any business, it's a relationship business. And, I mean, I have example after example of just relationships, and how, how that's really been a big part of my business, and not just with the seller financing stuff. But one thing, one metric that I would use, especially early on and and and to this day, is any money that I would put down, I needed to make sure that I made that back in the time period that they carried the financing.

So if they were going to carry the financing for only a couple years, I had to put a lot of money down. Would I make that money back? Yes, I would calculate my cash on cash return and, and such. But would I make that back in that time period? Whether it's two years, five years? Is that the worst case scenario and I've never had to do this. But if the worst case scenario is they had to foreclose or you had to give the property back, did you make all your money did you make all your money back, and so that was something I looked at early on, there are sellers that will carry financing, but they want a whole bunch down, and it's a, it's a high payment, and it's a short term, and those wouldn't be ones I'm interested in, because then in those cases, the seller gets the property back, and they do it again. And I've watched sellers strategically, strategically do that, they keep a little down payment, they're getting this high payment monthly, with knowing that more than likely they're going to get the property back and be able to do that again.

David:

I'm kinda in a situation, that seems to be a strategy like that, where the guy knew he was gonna get the property back and try to keep, different situation, more like didn't uphold his end of the contract and owed a lot of money in the deal. But we won't get into that.

But yeah, it's definitely like you said, it's true, people will do that. And they will take advantage of you if you're not. So I would say if you're looking into getting into seller financing, a book I heard recommended once and I haven't finished it yet, but it seems good so far as invest in debt, which is no longer in print, but understand how loans work. If you're going to be negotiating this stuff, don't shoot yourself in the foot by not understanding how the interest factors in and how the term factors in and like don't negotiate something if you don't understand what you're doing.

Gabriel:

Yep. And as I said before, to the sellers that want to cater to financing, I've never had to talk to a seller in the financing. So sellers, sellers that are willing to do it, they want to do it, they already see the advantage of being the bank and earning that interest. And so, again, as you said before, it's asking good questions, and then just listening and seeing what they need. And if you can help them solve their problem. They're happy.

David:

Absolutely, all about problem solving.

In fact, I've heard some investors say, I'm not a real estate investor, I solve problems. And I think there's some truth to that.

Gabriel:

Yeah, there's a lot. There's a lot to that.

David:

Awesome.

30:00 - 35:00

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David:

Well, let me ask you, do you have a favorite resource book, course, website that you would recommend to anyone getting started in real estate?

Gabriel:

You know, I love all the rich dad stuff, especially early on. You know, I get asked all the time, hey, where do I start? And I tell people Hey, read Rich Dad Poor Dad call me back.

So anyone that hasn't read that should read that I'm, as far as resources. I'm continuing to always educate myself through podcasts and through books and, and such.

So I think if there is a specific niche that someone's interested in, the information is out there finding people that are doing it and asking them the right questions. I found that most people that are in the business, they value their time a lot. But they're also very giving with people that are interested, I have a couple buddies right now that are fired up about shifting into real estate investing, and it's exciting for them. But it's also exciting for me to hear them on fire. It's this natural kind of coaching. And I enjoy that. And so today so.

David:

Well, you mentioned the coaching thing, I know you're in a mastermind group, and I know you buy into all that, as do I obviously, what do you think like? Where do you think mindset plays into all of this?

Gabriel:

I think it's huge, I think it's, it's, it's a big deal. You got to want to, you know, up here first, if you gotta want to, in your mind, it's I took a lot of the principles that I learned in high school wrestling into real estate investing. So it's, it's desire, you gotta have that desire, and ensure law of attraction, I believe that visualization wanting it. But you also got to put that into action.
So there's the desire piece, and then there's the execution piece.

So yeah, I told a lot of people, hey, I'm gonna win a state championship before I did. I told a lot of people. When I was deployed, I'm going to come back and I'm going to buy real estate. I'm going to build a real estate Empire, a real estate portfolio. And, yeah, a lot of people think you're crazy. And then you start proving to them and to yourself, hey, I'm doing this. So mindsets are huge. I think the part that's not talked about enough is the action piece, because desire alone isn't going to get the job done. You gotta want it, yes. But then you gotta put in the work and actually execute on those things, you got to make those calls and look at those properties and build those relationships. So that's how I feel about that.

David:

I like that you brought up the wrestling piece when you mentioned visualization, vision and like vision board and clarity has been something I've been, I don't wanna say struggling with this year. But it was a main focus point for like, a solid month where I was just like, okay, write this out, rewrite this re dream that's like, Where, where am I going with this? And, you know, it's like the old analogy about the guy cutting down a tree, and he just starts cutting a tree vise, the guy who takes 30 minutes to sharpen the axe first.

Gabriel:

Yeah.

David:

And I think that's very, very important. And the more I do it, the more I believe in it. But I also let you mentioned in there that people are gonna think you're crazy. So surely you've never had anyone tell you real estate investing was something you shouldn't do and you should just stay in your little w two lane.

Gabriel:

Right. Yeah. Never never, no.

Yeah, you know, I had very encouraging parents, but they were also you know, skeptical. How do you know this is gonna work? This feels risky. This seems risky. Same thing. Same thing with my buddies in my friends early on, you know, how do you know? How do you know this is gonna work, though. I'm gonna make it work.

Yeah, so to me, it's, it's drowning out the naysayers. And if you have a desire and you have a dream, don't don't let others get in your way. It's part of that goes back to who you're taking your advice from. You know, if you're, if you want fitness advice, who are you going to ask if you want financial advice, who you're going to ask, you're gonna ask someone that's been there and done that and has a track record and so I'm careful with who I listen to. And, you know, early on yeah, you have a lot of people that have never never done it telling you it's risky and then they end up getting jobs that they hate. And you know, they wonder why.

35:00 - 40:00

David:

That filter is something that a lot of people don't learn. And it is so, so important. We were talking about that before we hit the record where I'm debating whether I want to stay in the military or not. And I've got one side of the group that's like you're so far along, don't quit and the other the other group, that's like, dude, pull chops, you're done, do it. And I'm having to sit back. And that's the most important thing to me. Whenever someone gives me advice, do I want their life in 10 years? Like, do that what I aspire to be? And people forget that, you know, like, you'll hear the same thing. I started real estate investing, I had a few people that were like, that's a great idea. But the vast majority were like, I don't understand. So I'm gonna just tell you that stupid. And I had to sit back and go, Okay, great. Well, you're 65 and working a day job, do I want to be you, no, okay, well, then this guy is 45 and just spent three months in the Caribbean. Do I want to be him? Huh? Like, which, which one? Which one do I think is worth listening to?

Gabriel:

Right.

And I think a job is risky. I mean, really, it can, you know, your boss or whoever they can, they can end you it at any time. And I've seen that happen so many times, even if you love your job, which is, which is great. I mean, that's the flow of income. And if you love what you're doing, great, do it, do it forever. I mean, I met a surgeon recently that loves his job. But he also started syndicating real estate. So now he works on his own terms. He likes what he does, but he doesn't have to do it anymore. And that's the biggest difference.

If you love what you do, sure, keep doing it, but be in a position that you don't have to or that you can do it on your terms. You're not a slave to the job.

David:

Yeah. And that's huge that you mentioned that we're seeing a huge shift in this right now in the economy. I don't know if you saw the article. I haven't really dug into it. I don't know all the truth. But it's been getting shared around a lot lately. Apparently, General Electric, a General Electric, just suspended 20,000 pension payments this month.

Gabriel:

Well, yeah, I didn't know that. But stuff like that.

David:

Exactly. Like, there's a lot of things that people are supposed to do and companies are supposed to do and things are supposed to happen. But what if right, what are you doing to take control of that situation?

Gabriel:

Yeah, it's risky to not put your financial freedom in your own hands.

David:

Yeah, well, and I would always just joke with people like, yeah, you're right, it might not work. But you know what, I'd rather blame myself if it fails, because I suck then be able to blame a whole bunch of other people because I didn't do anything about it.

Gabriel:

Exactly. I'm with you. 100%. on that.

David:

Awesome.

Well, hey, before we wrap this up, is there anything you'd like to add any parting advice or big ideas?

Gabriel:

Yeah, I just want you know, your listeners, to go for it. If they have a dream, if they have a desire of a life to be a certain way, don't don't let anything hold you back. If there's something that you want, you know, you know, here's something to the value of time freedom. And I started talking a lot about time freedom recently. And I want people I want your listeners to really think about as they're building their portfolios, to not underestimate the value of time, early on, when I was young, younger, it was about I want to be rich and build this, this empire and, and there was some ego there. And as I really dug into it, what I really wanted was the freedom of time. And I've been careful with how I've built my business so that I still have my time. So I can spend time with my family and spend time on my health to be able to do the things that I want to do.

So I would say don't, don't lose sight of why you're building what you're building. Because I've seen the other side where people build something really great. But it just kills them because it takes up all their time and all their energy. And the reason that they started building it in the first place they've lost track of, and now it's 20 years later. And they put in all this time to something, but forgot about why they were doing it.

So don't underestimate the value of time freedom. There's ways to build without just killing all your time. And that would be the biggest thing I would say.

David:

We're in total agreement. That's my biggest decision. Or probably my biggest motivator for getting out like the guy when David Osborne spoke this past week.

Gabriel:

Right. He was so good.

David:

Oh, he was good. But he or was it? I don't know if it was him. Or if it was before that was someone. Oh is Jake and Gino actually started right before that someone said they were asking like, what's your motivation? And someone likes financial freedom. And the guy stopped and said, Okay, what does that mean to you? And immediately my answer is control of my schedule.

Gabriel:

Yep.

David:

Controlling my time. And I know if you use Brandon Turner, for example, that's somebody something I've always looked up to about him is that he does very well for himself. He could probably do better for himself. But he looks at everything through the filter of how do I do this without taking away from the life I have right now? Yeah, he's very good. He's probably the only person I know who truly lives the four hour workweek type lifestyle while being successful. Personally, no, personally, and man that's so big.

40:00 - 41:42

Gabriel:

Well and I think when I've talked to people, the more you dig into why they're doing what they're doing, it's usually that it almost always comes down to day one more time. And they want to be in control of what they do with that time.

David:

Yeah, I want to work when I want, where I want, how I want not that, I said, Yeah, I want to be able to sit around my boxers if I can.

Gabriel:

Yep.

David:

Awesome. Awesome.

Well, hey, thank you very much for joining us. Where can people get a hold of you?

Gabriel:

Yeah, the best way would be Instagram, Gabriel, our Hamel or Gabriel Hamel on Instagram. You can find me on Facebook too. And I have a website Hamelinvestments.com but I'm more active on Instagram these days.

David:

I know that's how we connected.

Gabriel:

Yes, we did.

David:

I feel special too, because we connected before I heard your BiggerPockets podcast. In fact, you told me about your bigger pockets episode as we were chatting and I was like, Oh, yeah, I gotta go listen to it. And then after I listened to it I was like, Oh, hey, you were in the military. We should talk about you being on my show.

Gabriel:

Yeah. And then we got to hang out. We got to hang out this week, which was cool to be able to spend some time before recording.

David:

Yeah, it's rare that I get to see people in person first. It's usually like, hey, you've been on my show. And now we're going to be at the same place. Let's meet up.

Awesome.

Well, hey, Gabriel, thank you so much for joining us today. This has been a really great episode and I know people are just gonna get so much value out of this.

Gabriel:

Cool man. I appreciate what you do.

David:

Thanks.

End:

Thank you for listening to another episode about my journey From military to millionaire. If you liked it, be sure to visit Frommilitarytomillionaire.com/podcast to subscribe to future podcasts. While you're there, we'd love for you to rate the show. Give us a review on iTunes. Now get out there and take action.