00:00 - 05:00

David:

Today we have an exciting episode, right. So we've got Ryan Doucet and Max Edson, who are both active duty Air Force they met at the Academy, they played hockey together and I had the chance to jump on a phone call with one of them about two, three weeks ago and talk a little bit about what they're doing. And basically, they've built a platform software to help real estate investors with a lot of the data and analytics and help you with your investing, I guess style, whatever, whatever the fancy word that I would use there because I don't speak big words in the Marine Corps.

But they've built a platform that is used to help people improve their investment strategies. And I thought it was really interesting, especially from the fact that they are both active duty which obviously I have a soft spot for. So why don't get him on the show so that we can talk about their platform for one but also the ins and outs of building out something while you're active duty because I think that's really cool. And a lot of people are doing side hustles

Intro:

Welcome to the military millionaire podcast where we teach servicemembers, veterans and their families how to build wealth through personal finance, entrepreneurship and real estate investing.

I'm your host, David Pere. And together with my co host, Alex Felice. We're here to be your no BS guys along the most important mission, you'll ever embark on your finances.

Roger, Vic One Oscar Mike.

David:

Gentlemen, welcome to the show.

Max:

Thank you.

Ryan:

Thanks for having us.

Thank you.

David:

Yeah, absolutely. Why don't you give a little bit about your backstory for the audience?

Ryan:

Definitely.

So Max and I met at the Air Force Academy, we played hockey there together. And we actually were a year apart. And then Max, you know, had an injury that came back a year, and we ended up graduating together. And when we were in school there together, we were really into projects and sort of like innovation, we actually did a competition for fidelity our senior year. And so we were like, really interested in this sort of creative collaboration and producing something. And so that kind of took off after we graduated, we kind of continued to do that. We built this product for like a year and a half called nucleus, which was like a crypto app that got all of maybe one user for like a day. And we were like, well, that sucked. And then we moved on to the next thing.

And yeah, and so Max and I were living in LA at the same time, last year, and we kind of kind of synced up on this, this land investing thing. And, and it seemed like a really cool idea, you know, maximum doing it for a couple of years. And, you know, like, I had the software background. So I was like, Oh, this seems like something we could really automate. And we were going to do it for ourselves. We wanted to automate it for our own purposes, our internal sort of land investing strategies, and, and to get validation for that we started emailing these people just kind of blindly be like, what do you think of this? Like, we could price this area, we could do this. And they were like, that's awesome. Like, I love that. And, and the more people that kind of said, they were like, Hmm, maybe there's more than just us, they could use this.

And so you know, that was a year ago. So we launched our product in July. And we've been kind of scrambling ever since to try and keep up with the demand of people that are just like, Oh, this is fantastic. Like can we add this, can we add that? You know, I love this idea. And I mean, you know, people saying how much it's helped them. So it's been a really cool, a really cool journey.

Max:

Yeah, and just something to add on that when you think of real estate, you don't really think too much about land investing itself. So we found ourselves in a pretty interesting niche. And I actually was originally introduced to it by another Air Force guy. And so what I found interesting was that you don't have to deal with the tenants, termites, toilets kind of scenario, you can invest all over the country without being there.

So instead of real estate properties, where you're investing in the same market, usually where you're actually located in and land, you could actually flip wherever you want. So what our platform actually does is it deals with direct mail marketing campaigns, and allows you to get those records, those owner records, and then put offers to them. So we're sending out blind letters actually to wherever we want to mail with the criteria that we've set. And so when I first started this business, it was a very manual process, but it didn't have to be.

And so it often gets overlooked again, with the just the property market and there's a lot of data out there. But with land, it's a lot less complete. And so what we did, we put our heads together, we came up with our own software, like Ryan mentioned. And ever since then we've kind of been turning into our own processes. It's definitely alleviated a lot of stress and a lot of work on our end. And just because we are still in Air Force active duty, our whole goal is to automate as much as possible because we don't have as much time as a lot of people.

So it was really helpful. And we're still continuing to automate the process and we're getting feedback from users and just moving forward from there.

05:00 - 10:00

Alex:

So, the marketing side, how is this different than what the wholesalers do for properties, regular properties? Are you familiar with what they do?

Max:

Yeah, so it's very similar. It's the same process where you send out letters if you're doing direct mail market campaigns, and you can do wholesales and this so all of our contracts that we send out do have clauses in there where they're assignable. So we can actually give them off to other people to invest in or buy. So you can make some profit on the assignment like that from that standpoint, but a lot of the people, they just flip them around.

So if, let's say, usually, on average, you want to send an offer out anywhere between four lands, specifically, it could be anywhere as low as 15%, as high as 35-40%. And from that standpoint, when you buy it, you can do a quick flip from there for, I don't know, 80 to 100% of market value.

Alex:

So you have a really interesting client base, though, I imagine because the people like us buy, like, dude, I buy dead ass reliable rentals. Right, I'm the risk averse guy who I don't buy anything, unless I know it's gonna make money before I even, you know, go anywhere close to paying for it.

But land is very speculative, or at least theoretically. Now, if you're buying it on 15 cents on the dollar 40. It's not as speculative, but there is no cash income. So do you find it? How do you find these? These people can't be? How do I say it? The overlap must be different.

So how are you finding the buyers for land? versus, you know, in our little world where everybody wants cash flow?

Max

Yeah, and that's a great question, because cash flow is king from a lot of people's perspective. And so what we do is we've actually plugged ourselves into a lot of these educational programs out there, where people are learning how to flip land through them. And from that we've created partnerships, so then they just funnel over to us from that standpoint.

So it's a really cool partnership, because again, we're not stepping on their toes, we're just an added feature to them. And so we automate the process that they're already teaching. And because of that, and, and offer prices, everything, usually in our system, how you're mentioning, you need to be as risk averse as possible. And if you buy a property that's over what it's actually should be marketed as, then you're going to, you could be stuck with a property you don't want, or it could sit on the market for too long.

So what we've actually done, which is one of the unique features that we offer is that we've basically aggregated over 2.5 million comps across the United States from sites like Zillow, lands of America, realtor.com, landflip, and landwatch.

And so we have this large database of comps, where if you just went on and searched an address for a property, you can find one of those estimates or average estimates online for the market value. But for land, they don't have them. And so we created that valuation model for all of our users. And so they can just have a quick slider bar left or right to turn on the percentage of market value you want to offer at. And then they send out 1000s of letters and get them back. And there's always due diligence in there. But because of that you can really narrow down and get a realtor out there to make sure that they can sell it at a certain price before you even buy it. And so you have all the risk strategies in there before you even purchase the property.

David:

Are you, I don't know if I caught this right. But these letters, if you're doing a slider bar, are the letters you're sending out having a price on it?

Max:

Oh yeah, so we send out blind offers. And for those that don't know, blind offers that that means like a literal offer price on the letter that we send out.

So you have the neutral letters, where it's just asking, Hey, I'd like to buy your land and then you basically do the negotiations after the fact. But we send out letters with those offers actually on there and we always have a clause too. So we're not locked in. We can kind of step away for any reason, but we have that direct offer price on there. So then all they have to do is sign the contract that we send and then we can move that over to escrow.

Alex:

I actually like that, actually really like that because I think part of the reason that the wholesalers know they have no balls, right? Like I want the property but I want it for as low as possible. I want to get you hooked before I negotiate. I want to see the property negotiate all this stuff and it's like Dude, if you send people prices you get more but you gotta sack up which you know sorry wholesalers. Yeah, I mean so I love that you do that even though Yeah, you but you build yourself into due diligence right a clause I understand that.

David:

Yeah, and more interesting hits, right. But I feel like the due diligence is also less risky because you know, you send up if you were to blind offer out for 70% or 60% or 50% on a house. You don't know if the house has been burned down. Right? You have no idea you know, I feel like there's a lot I don't know correct me if I'm wrong. I feel like there's less variables to go wrong on the land side.

Max:

Totally.

And so like how you kind of mentioned houses, there's so many different things. You got the actual structure. Yeah, there's too many to even count. But on land. It's really about what's it looking like? What kind of property is it on the side of a mountain? Is it even usable is the road access.

So there's a lot less variables involved. And because of that, we feel so much more comfortable sending out those letters that like, again, 20 25% of the value. And what's really cool is that you go through less due diligence in negotiations with the actual sellers themselves, because they already have that value in their heads now.

So whatever mail you get back, they're either signing the contract and sending it right back to you. So you already have that. And honestly, even if they sign the contract, because we have those clauses in there, we can still do our due diligence and negotiate further if needed. But then even if there are negotiations there, that number is already in their head, so we can get it usually around there.

10:00 - 15:00

Alex:

Yeah, so you guys really don't have to deal with the environment? What's, you know, what's under the groundwater? I think he said, road access and water access, and like, you know, drainage, but you're not really, you guys aren't really spending too much time. It doesn't sound like learning the different types of land all over the country, especially when you're trying to buy it at 25%.

Are you getting a lot of motivated sellers? Or is it a I'm curious, what's the what the selling demo demographic is?

Max

Yeah, it's, it's really interesting actually, to see. So a lot of people, some people don't even know that they own land, which is the most interesting to me. It's either someone in their family died or just got passed down, and no one even told them. And so it's in their name, and they just have no idea. And so they just want the money because they have no use for it. So they'll go ahead and sell it.

Some people are going through divorces, some people just have no need for it. And so or they just need money for whatever reason, whatever is going on in their life situation. But it really kind of revolves around those factors, and just that they don't need any more or they're retiring.

And so we take that author hands,

Ryan:

Get a lot of hate mail or calls at the same time right here. You send a lot of lowball offers to people that weren't planning on selling and it's actually funny the first time we did this, we did a lot of people use call services, but we were trying to save money. So we're like, I will just take the calls ourselves. And there's like a two week period where our phones were non stop ringing with people like, Who do you think you are offering me like this amount? Like I'm not selling like get me off your list. And I'm, I told Max like, we're never doing that again. We need a cost here.

Max:

It could be pretty demoralizing.

Alex:

You guys are scoundrels. That's the territory.

Ryan:

Yeah, like 1000 people, and you really only need to get a few yes to really get a property under contract. So you're gonna go through a few 100 you know, who do you think you are? Before you get that one Yes.

David:

Yeah, it’s just part of the game, though. It's all good.

I'm glad you mentioned the call center thing. So I'm doing that right now for my inbound and it's a lifesaver, because I even after three years of being a recruiter, like, there's only so many Hey, buddy, fuck you where you're like, bro, like, you didn't even have to call me like you went out of your way to call me just to tell me that. Thanks, dude.

You know, it's like, I don't understand. All right, it gets old even no matter how many times you do it. It's like, Alright, you know what, this is one thing I can cut out of my life. And all I get now is the like, hey, so and so scheduled an appointment? Here's all the information they want to talk to you like, Oh, great. I'll pick up the phone and call them. So much better.

Max:

Yeah.

David:

I was gonna ask, well, I guess I had, the first thing I was gonna ask was zoning. I'm curious about, you know, I mean, zoning codes differ all across the nation for you know, the same freaking things like is there a way to generalize that where you're like, hey, I want only things zoned commercial, even though the commercial zoning is going to be 17 different codes, depending on where you're marketing. It'd be my first question.

Max:

Yeah. Ryan, do you want to take it?

Ryan:

Well, so there's kind of two answers to that.

So we do have on our site, we have zoning codes where you can filter land for sorry, those are flood zone codes. So we do have land use codes, which are basically your zoning codes, it's how the property is, like, categorized, that's going to be different for every county and so it kind of leaves the onus on the person that's failing to know what the predominant land type is. And it's tough because, you know, some counties will say, you know, this is agricultural land, and some will say, Well, no, it's actually you know, SFR land or this is farmland and or you know, the forest so it's kind of hit or miss with that. We have all the different checkboxes you can kind of play around with like in different counties, like where the properties are located.

And then I was also going to give a quick plug to one of our partners zoning advantage. Mike Marshall there has a website that he's starting up where they're looking for, you know, zoning codes that are mismatched use because you mentioned zoning, and you know what he what his website does, and it's fairly new, so I don't know how many locations he actually has in place, but he's looking for mismatch zoning opportunities is essentially the goal there. But I figured I'd give him a shout out.

David:

I like that. So the other question is...

15:00 - 20:00

Alex:

Do you use our platform to plug somebody else?

Ryan:

He's really, he's a really cool, really cool guy. He has really insightful ideas.

David:

It's cool. Alex is gonna plug something for himself before the end of the session. So he's using my platform plugin. He's just mad. Someone beat him to it.

So the next question I was gonna ask is price point, right? So if you're sending out like a full on offer, right, I would imagine there's a little bit more to that than just like a postcard that's like, Hi, I buy houses cash, call me.

So I'm curious, like, what a letter costs through your system, and kind of what that I guess what that looks like?

Max:

Yeah, and so, so kind of the process is you have to download owner records first. And then once you have that owner record spreadsheet, essentially, you want to send that to your mail house to send out letters.

So what we do is basically, our finished product is this downloadable spreadsheet with all the owner records attached to it and the offer prices. And then from there, you'd want to send it to your mail house, wherever you have it.

So what we do is, offer eight cents per record download. And so every time you download, it'll be eight cents a record. And then from there, usually you can get, we send out actual letters. So some people do postcards, some people, there's just a whole bunch of different things you could actually send out, but we send out two to two pages of letters actually, per envelope. And so one is going to be kind of our cover page. And then one is the actual purchase agreement. And that's about 50 cents for us per letter as well. So it is more expensive. But the yield that you can get off of it is really good.

David:

I mean, the list itself isn't? I mean, 1000 names for 80 bucks, assuming that my math that you saw me rolling my eyes about my math and my public is right. That's not it's not bad. I mean.

Max:

No, ours is actually really cheap. And the reason why is because we've partnered with data tree by first American. And so what we've done is leverage them and again, our scalability of our platform.

So we're getting really cheap rates for everyone. So we're the ones locked into our contracts with them. And all of our users don't have to get locked in at all. So they can cancel with us and use their data as they go. And so a lot of the times when you go with these platforms, you have to put down a lot of money to get cheap record costs, or you have to just sign up and lock yourself in for a year to contract. And so we kind of alleviate that burden from the users perspective and put it on ourselves. So they can pass through the cheap record cost.

And so with that, as well, we get all the searching, we give them the offer price attached to that we actually clean up their data file too. So I don't know if you or anyone else has actually downloaded from one of these record companies. It can be a mess sometimes and not really prepped and ready to send to your mail house. And so we actually clean up the file for you. And so it's ready to go and you could just send it in and merge it with your letter template.

David:

I like it.

Alex:

Oh, so you're selling so hard right now?

Max:

it's, it's been a long time coming.

Alex:

Tell me. Okay, I know you're excited. I can tell.

So tell me about the business stuff. Let's talk about um, let's talk about scalability. You're one year in. Okay, with an economic phenomenon called Lindy?

Max:

Actually, no.

Ryan:

No.

Alex:

Lindy says, the shorter that you've been around, the more likely it is you're going to go away soon. And the longer you've been around, the longer you're gonna, it's likely that you're going to stay around for a long time.

So one year, one year is not that much. So you're scaling up, what's the what's the current talking about trajectory? Or current hurdles? And how are you guys gonna, um, what's in store for the next year to grow this thing?

Max:

Yeah, those are all great questions. And, and ones, honestly, we have these winter weekly targets. And we ask ourselves the same ones every time. And so one of our main hurdles right now is actually customer support, getting ourselves out of the day to day business. So we can focus on improving it, and then actually working on other pillars of revenue that we can create on our platform.

And so right now, we started about a year ago, but we actually launched back in July, so it's even less time than a year. But we've been growing pretty rapidly. And we have key KPI trackers that we keep track of on a monthly and weekly basis that are moving us forward and keeping us in the right direction.

And one of the things again, like I mentioned, the support is a big one. And we're just continuing to try to automate each process that we can go through and then also with that, having different upsales and then also having different platforms so we have our our price platform that does the actual pricing and then downloading a records but then we have our own business for land flipping itself, and just continuing to create those other pillars.

So if one pillar falls, we don't fall as a whole company. And so that that's been a big thing that we've been trying to strive for and work on lately. So Obviously, we want every pillar to succeed on its own, but we want to make sure that we're stable enough where if one falls, then we still have enough around it to keep us afloat.

20:00 - 25:00

Sponsor:

Hey guys, before we dig into today's episode, I want to talk to you briefly about the website, carrot or investorcarrot.com, which is a website that generates other websites for you.

So you can sign up for this, you generate a website, and they create high SEO quality websites for you. Now, yeah, they charge a little bit of fee per month. But what they also do is they produce content, like blog posts for you, and other stuff, they help you with web design, they help you with ranking on SEO, they help put out articles with you, and they help get you to rank in Google.

So if you're looking to generate leads, where somebody can find you, when they type in, sell my house fast. Carrot does an incredible job. And I know a lot of wholesalers who do very, very good work, and they all love this website.

So I'm not going to do it justice, if I try to talk to you about it in super detail, I'm fairly new to it. I love it, love it, but I'm fairly new to it. But if you click the link that will be in the description, you'll get a link to a free, they've got like a free webinar, a free demo, whatever you can check it out if you like it cool, if not whatever, but this is the sponsor for today's episode is carrot which I am a big fan of, and have a great day we're commencing now.

Ryan:

Yeah, and I'll just add that like one of those pillars, so like, you know, initially, we just get as many users as we could in the door, downloading records using the service. And that's been a pretty decent model so far.

But you know, at some point users are going to dry up, it's a pretty niche market. And so it's not like there's a million users out there that we're going to acquire. And so like, we've also been looking, you know, Max mentioned, we're doing the land flipping thing. We've also looked into, like partnerships, I think that's a really big one, because there's a lot of folks that do this at a really large scale, but they have a very unique way of doing it.

And so what we can provide to them is really cool data insights, because we have access to all these comps and access to, you know, all of this data where we can say hey, let's let's work together, you're looking for these specific things, we can provide those to you specifically, you know, for your process, and then in return, we get something out of that. But you know, there because most folks will download 1000 to 2000 records a month. But you know, these people are in the 50,000 range a month. And so it's a pretty big operation. And they just need a lot of support to do that.

Alex:

Is it just YouTube? It's not just YouTube, but I've been on the website, it’s a couple of you guys?

Ryan:

So it's just Max and I, we hired quote, unquote, interns. One of them is my brother.

Alex:

I saw another Doucet there. So.

Max:

We've got some free labor going on.

Ryan:

Yeah, pretty much. My brother and his friend, they're both in the army. And yeah, so we were, we tried to start getting them involved, just to help kind of with that burden of doing all of this work. But for the most part, yeah, you know, Max and I have been doing all this.

Alex:

Your poor brother, man, you're like I joined the army. I'm habitually underpaid. And then I got the second job that also doesn't pay. Nice nice.

Ryan:

Max and I are laughing because you know, we're here working and he's like, sorry, guys. I can't do anything this week. I got to go into the field for a week and sleep in a tent and do all this. We're like, what like, if we never do that in there for so we're just like, so blown away? We're like, what are you doing?

Max:

Yeah, we kind of have a normal like 9 to 5 jobs. And yeah, he's out struggling in the woods when it's raining out and lightning on them I don't know. It's kind of funny.

David:

Oh, hurry up, buddy. We gotta get you back to work for free.

Ryan:

Yeah I need that marketing playing by 7 buddies. Let's go.

Max:

What's going on?

Ryan:

He's on his phone. He's like sitting on tanks like trying to respond to us on a text message.

Alex:

Yo, my man is committed though.

Ryan:

Yeah, he loves it.

David:

I love the intern idea straight up like I'm as I'm moving to get out for one, I'm going to intern on my way out of the military of active duty into the reserves. But I'm absolutely looking for the idea of if I could have you know, a service member or two that fit kind of what I'm looking for, to intern with me and just make sure they're a good fit. Like, obviously, I'd be down for paying but like with the skill Bridge Program, that's a pretty sweet option if you got someone who wanted to intern with you. And they do it in their last six months while they're still active duty. So like you're not paying them but they're still getting full military pay. You know, there's a pretty sweet little niche there that I think offers great opportunities.

Alex:

That's what my nemesis does. She does that a lot.

David:

Yeah, yeah, that's what I'm trying to do. While I'm trying to do that myself as an intern.

Alex:

Why like that when you can just have his brother do it, you know, he’s got a full time job and he...

Ryan:

Interns are really cool. A cool option, you know, because there's, there's so much you know, the six months is needed, right? Because there's so much to learn just about the business as a whole and then total learning how our system specifically works in that business to be able to actually provide a value to the customers like, like max mentioned, like a lot of it is customer support, people have a lot of questions. And if you don't know the business or our platform, it's really hard to answer those questions.

So there is a pretty substantial ramp up time to get them up to speed on what's going on and how to be, you know, valuable to the customers.

25:00 - 30:00

Max:

So yeah, and additionally, for those that want to get a little more acclimated to business, as opposed to Air Force, because there are just military in general, because there are totally two different sides of the spectrum there is in business, I mean, if you don't make profit enough, you're gonna fail, right? So we're not, that's not our mission in the military. And so there's different parts of it, and just seeing how you have to operate differently. It's really interesting. So like, obviously, we get value out of it as a company, but then also they get value added understanding a little bit more on the business side of everything.

David:

Yeah.

Alex:

Yeah, the military is not a business. In fact, that literally is the definition between capitalism and socialism.

David:

I'm gonna ask, oh I’m gonna let Alex ask.

Alex:

Yeah, I'm gonna ask.

So on the flip side, and you guys decide the buyers for the land. So I worked in banking for a while. And I know that financing for land. I don't know what it's like right now. But I guess it can be tumultuous to say the least. Are you guys? Do you have to deal with buyers who want to buy your properties but can't pay cash and try to finance it? Is that something I'd have to deal with?

Max:

Yeah, and and so there's, there's two sides of that.

So one, when we're actually identifying land to look at, we want to look at the price point of it. So have you mentioned a, it's, it's really hard to get a loan on land, especially because there's not going to be any production of cash flow for the most part.

So that we usually make sure that what we're buying, if we're buying it for 5-$10,000, and it's selling for 30-$40,000, that's enough where people can buy just straight up in cash. And so most of our buyers are going to be cash buyers. And let's say, if they don't have that money, what we actually do is seller financing, and our owner financing, and we have these really cool sites that are coming out now where they actually take care of that whole process for us.

So one, in particular that we use is Fabrica, and essentially, they've created a digital domain online where people can go and buy it, and it automatically creates the interest rate for them. And so it's just a certain amount down, and then they'll just pay us X percent every month until they own the property outright. And at that time, then the actual deed will transfer automatically.

Alex:

Who pays for the building?

Max:

Who pays the building?

Alex:

I mean who pays for the land?

Max:

So the buyer will continue to pay for it.

David:

But you're buying cash?

Max:

So we'll buy in cash up front, and then when the seller or I mean, when we go to sell it, they're going to be the ones to actually either pay cash again to buy it, or they'll do the financing option.

Alex:

But the financing, it's just a they set up the payment infrastructure, you still hold the, you still have these the cost?

Max:

Yeah. Well, because we bought it in cash. I mean, there is no cost to us.

Alex:

No, I mean, like you're the money is, the money is your money is still being held.

Max:

Yeah, correct. Until yeah.

And so usually, usually how the seller financing works is that we will get it for a low enough where they will give us a downpayment to cover our money back, so that's where we get our money back, and then plus that additional cash flow.

And that's one way how you can actually get cash flow out of land is then for that reason, it's the returns actually pretty great. If you set it up, right, where, let's say the market value of a property is $10,000, we got it for $2,000. So we could do seller financing, essentially 2000 down and then X percent until they own the property outright. And so we get our money back immediately. And then now we have cash flow from that until they either own it outright or they don't pay it off. And then we keep it and then we can do the same process again, which happens.

Alex:

I used to know a guy, I’m gonna tell a quick story. I used to know a guy who would wholesale cars, cheap old cars, and he had a little rock lot. Everybody in the army here, right? We know the rock a lot and so he bought these 100,000 miles, eight year old cars, whatever. And he sells like three grand five grand six grand.

And so what he does is he gets this car from the auction for like 1500 bucks, and he put in the lot and it's five grand. And he financed it all in house because he put the money up and he found it at 18% and he put a GPS tracker in it and he put the spare key and he put a turn off like a kill switch in it. And so um, you know, he fell off a car and a 15 $100 down and you find out the rest. He's like, Okay, I'm paid.

And then inevitably, like eight months, 12 months later they stopped the payments, and he killed it and then he drove up with a spare key and drove home and put it back into one for 1500 bucks.

That’s the model right?

30:00 - 35:00

Max:

It's not like we want that to happen, but it does happen.

It's true. It's just like infinity cash flows.

Ryan:

When they drive it across the country he's got up he's got to fly to go get it now?

David:

Why gonna ask those kinds of questions?

Ryan:

They can't move the land right, it's stationary. If they put the car anywhere.

Max:

Once they start digging, but I know.

David:

You bought on the west side, the east side of the Big Island of Hawaii.

Max:

There you go.

Alex:

One last question.

Do you guys ever buy anything? Um, or have you yet bought something that was maybe a speculative, like, oh, they're gonna build. It's in a piece of area that's like gentrifying or something that you got really like, man, if I hold on to this for 10 years, they might build a road bike or build something tricky here. Is that something you guys have done?

Max:

We haven't yet.

Usually what we're doing is it, we don't hold it for that long, for the most part. And that's why we do buy in places where it is like that, where we know that it's a growing market. So one of our factors when we're looking at new places to mail is what's that expansion looking like?

So again, like job growth, growth rate, just all those economic factors, and then just how the day is on markets looking around that area, too. So we'll buy it again, we'll go through our process where we're buying it for a quarter of that what it's actually worth, and then we'll just go around and flip it again, for the most part, we've thought about doing it, but it's just it just ties up too much money for the most part, that's that's the biggest thing.

Alex:

And that holds periods, because it was obvious, the price that nobody would sell to you for 25 cents on the dollar. The trick is like, Man, you get a bunch of these 5000 things and some, you know, oh, in 20 years, they're gonna build a skyscraper where I want to own this property. It’s amazing.

Max:

Yeah.

Alex:

I was just curious.

David:

The perfect world.

Max:

It's great. I just don't know if I have the patience to wait for that. I'd rather run like I get a rental property or something. But I've heard people doing that.

Alex:

Yeah, it's not a really good strategy. But I'll just...

David:

So I had one last question before we rolled in our normal three. And that is. So obviously, this is a very niche market space that you guys have found it very unique. I like it.

I guess two parts, one would be if there's competitors in your space yet. And then the part of that would be if you're afraid or worried about like a big data company trying to nose their way in. And the other would be? Have you guys figured out like, end goal? Right?

So are you wanting to maintain the platform? Or are you looking to build it? And have you thought about what I mean, there's probably a potential there to sell if you patent it to sell it to the software side of it to somebody like one of those big data sets? I'm just curious if that's something you guys have given thought to or if you're still in almost a hamster mode startup mode, like like, you know, like, or just weren't doing everything.

So I hope that doesn't sound like a, you know, like a loaded question. I'm just genuinely curious what kind of competition you guys see and what kind of opportunities there might be out there for that.

Ryan:

Yeah, so we are kind of in hamster mode still a little bit, where we just kind of do it as many things as we can. And if someone's like, oh, it'd be a good idea. We're like, Alright, let's do it. Like, we just want to, like just branch out as quickly as possible. And many things are starting to realize that there's a lot of competition in this space, but mostly in the housing. So we actually launched the housing feature, like a month ago, thinking, Oh, like, we know, we started with land, we'll move into housing. And we realize there's a lot of people that do housing, because there's so much data available on it. And it's fairly easy to get into that space, not as much so Atlanta, so we've kind of realized Atlanta is where our opportunity is, you know, we we've gone to sites like Zillow, and realtor and they their land data, they have it but like Zillow, they don't have a lot of estimates for land, like they just don't really do a whole lot with it.

And so I feel like in that regard, we have a lot of an advantage, you know, over some of these other people that I've met, whether it's because they don't really care enough, or they just don't see it as valuable. I'm not, I'm not totally sure, but there's definitely an opportunity there was the other question, right angle.

We've thought about it, you know, it's right now, I think it's too early to tell what we want to do with it. Like if, if a big data company came in and said, we want to buy your company for a million dollars, like there'd be some serious consideration for that rather than Oh, that was you know, six months of that was pretty cool.

35:00 - 40:00

Ryan:

But you know, like there's there's some cool opportunities that are that we're starting to discover as we as we do it more and more and we're starting to get this kind of cool feedback loop Finally, where like the first time Use the first wave of users that came in July and tested out the product and tried it starting to get back to us fine. Like, hey, you know, I just closed deals from that original mailer back in July. And so we're starting to kind of hear what we could improve on in our overall process, like how we can improve our pricing.

And it's funny, we actually changed so fast that all their feedback there again, I did this in July, and I could change these things, right? Oh, we changed those months ago. Like, you got to keep up, man. I said, we go faster than that. So yes, we're still trying to discover that opportunity. I don't know if Max has other thoughts on that.

Max:

I think the only thing else we've discussed is that this is a business where it's kind of funny, we've put a lot of effort into this actual website. But a lot of the money is coming from the actual land flipping itself, where we don't have too much time to do right now. So just kind of getting our priorities straight, almost kind of looking at that credo principle rule, we're at 20, where we're trying to figure out where it's best to allocate our time. And so going to the, to the end goal, I think something where it's an acquisition deal is something that we're looking into. And then we have to get it's obviously a mature state where we're not quite there yet, I don't think but we're, we're moving in the right direction. And then obviously transferring over all of our flips, in land all of our cash in this website, and moving into more of a cash flowing business, like you're mentioning earlier, Alex was kind of like rental properties where you get that cash flow and in steady cash flow every month over month.

So that's, that's kind of like our end goal is basically taking what we have here, and then just making it and taking advantage of this cash flow, and then just multiplying it through some other means.

David:

I like it.

Alex:

I love the innovation.

I like that you guys recognize that land is definitely not popular. And I think that provides a lot of opportunity. I mean, the numbers you guys are spitting out sounds awesome. And the risk and the risk are just so much less work.

I mean, houses come with all sorts of nonsense, and a lot of unknowns. And like generally they come with people, which is a miserable experience, you know, they'll have to go through the motions and needs. Land. Yeah, easy.

David:

You know, I know a lot more really useful landscapers than I do contractors. So there might be something to that.

Max:

There's a lesson in there somewhere, I think.

David:

Hey, I know some 14 year olds that can do some mean landscaping. So.

Alex:

That is illegal just so you know.

David:

Alex is clearly not from the south, where kids just build their own lawn mowing businesses, and lemon lemonade stands. It's like you know, anyway.

Alright, so I got a few questions I always ask the first one is, obviously you guys are new to the not new to but you're entrepreneurs in Spirit through and through.

So the question would be if a young E one, E two, 18-19 year old was to walk up to you asking you for advice on whether that's investing or building a business? Like what would be the one thing you think you'd have to tell them?

Max:

Oh, yeah, that's, I mean, that's one of the things is really just understanding how much work it really takes to build a business. So a lot of people see the just the, the very, like shell of what's going on. And so they think it's all glamour and joy. But underneath the service, there's a lot of work that gets put into play and a lot of late nights and making sure that there's a lot of processes that go in. And, and a lot of, like hardships throughout, it doesn't go easy, and there's a lot of pivoting, and that's involved.

So finding something that they really enjoy, I think is important. And because if you don't like it, even though you may create a little bit of money, that part goes away really quickly. And so you get to have the fun and joy behind the scenes that will make you push through it. And so that's one of the big things and just setting aside money every month, if you have an idea in mind, and really investing in yourself first. So that's, that's probably what I've, I've learned the most is, it doesn't come easy. It's not a it's not something you can buy just a car, usually the first month into it and say that I'm rich now, it doesn't come like that. But it's a long gradual process with a lot of obstacles and roadblocks in the way.

Ryan:

Yeah, and I think with that, like, you know, me 18 or 19 if I had an idea I would tell that person like just try it and be okay to fail, right. Like, you know, I mentioned a few project max I worked on prior to coming into this. And, you know, we spent like a year and a half building a software application. I had one user and we made $0. And it was like, wow, we really stink. But we realized after about six months of doing this, how many lessons we liked pulled out of that and even like, literal code I pulled out of that to this project. I was like, cool. Like, I already figured out how to do that thing. And so there was so much value in that even though we didn't make any money or the business wasn't successful. So just being comfortably like, Hey, I'm gonna try this thing. And if it works great, and if it fails, even better, I like I'll just I'll learn something and then I'll do better with the next business.

40:00 - 45:00

David:

I like it.

Alex:

I like that. And that's such an under-appreciated lesson I think about this in our little social circles.

You know, I've got my fourth podcast, right the first three all died. I had a bunch of businesses, I tried a bunch of businesses before I found real estate and stuff. And some I could do that stuck. And I'm sure I'll end up eventually failing at this and doing something else that I'm somewhat good at.

But yeah, I love that. And you know, people go well, that fails. It's like, dude, you know how much I took away, though, that like I carry with me now. So you say fail. It's like I left the failure behind me. And I took what worked with me.

Ryan:

And so especially, you're changing industries, right? Because you like you go from one thing to another thing, like you go from real estate, and then you go into cars or something. And you're like, man, I really love real estate. Now that I've done this other industry. I'm like, I really love the other one. So now I know, cool. I kind of know where the industry is. Now he's got to find the business in that space.

David:

Yeah, yeah.

Max:

And it builds upon each other too. So I mean, you learn one thing from one thing it fails, then you take what you learn there and move it to another one, it fails. And now you start building these blocks up. I mean, what Ryan was mentioning how we, we pitched fidelity and one contest. And then we took our idea and went to Northwestern, and we basically got lost or laughed after the meeting, we went there with no business plan, just just essentially this idea. And they're just what, what do you want us to do with it? And we didn't really know. And so that was kind of our first taste of Okay, we should probably come up with a business plan next time.

And then we built this nucleus app, basically created the product without even asking anyone if it's something that they liked. And so we were like, okay, we should probably get some feedback this time. And then, again, we started this thing. And so we took a long time before even building anything, just on paper and idea form and just reached out to a lot of people and got all their feedback, and then built the product with them already interested in it.

Alex:

I love that you say this, actually. Because I tell people all the time, and I've been doing it, I had a Sunday meet them and tell them like if you have an idea, and you can't write it on paper and then have somebody else understand it and buy into the idea, then you have no idea. Because if you can only sell somebody face to face, you might be a charlatan, you might be a con man, right? Like you only believe me when I'm smiling and like getting you amped up. Like if you can't read it on paper and think it's a good idea, then it might not. You might not know what your idea is, you might just be around. Easy to please, people are easy to sell people.

So I love what they said, put it on paper, write it out thoroughly, like a business plan. So most things like you don't need one. But you kind of need one.

David:

Yeah, get you a friend like Alex, who will tell you it sucks. Because we all know that there are people who will just know, don't don't go show your business plan to your mom. Cuz you ain't gonna get any good feedback.

“Oh baby it’s great”

Ryna:

What's what's cool about that feedback, too, is like we started with like an initial, like, here's what we're going to do. And then we got feedback. We're like, oh, wow, there's like this opportunity here. We're going to do this thing. And, and then like, you start to create that and continue to get that feedback. And it just keeps kind of moving and shifting based on what people are saying what they want. And then it ends up not being the product you probably thought it was gonna be, but it's the product that people are saying that they want. And that's what's gonna be a successful product, right? Not the thing that you think is going to be good. It's what your users think is good.

David:

Absolutely.

Alright, so the next question is, what is one resource, book, course, website? Whatever, that you think anyone getting into real estate or business should read?

Max:

Oh, that's, that's a good one. I think if you ask any real estate investor, it's going to be Robert Kiyosaki’s book, drawing a blank on it right now. The cashflow quadrant or the other one.

David:

Yeah, Rich Dad, Poor Dad.

Max:

Yeah, Rich Dad, Poor Dad.

You can go so many different ways with that. But it really helps you understand what kind of business model that you want to kind of design. So that was something that I really liked to understand and enjoy, because it kind of focused our mindsets on what we're going to build. And then kind of like talking about our end goal before is where do we want to move into? Are we going to be in that employer quadrant or kind of like business or investor and then another platform for real estate. Bigger pockets is awesome. Like I've, I've asked so many questions on here, where they're able to answer.

What was that?

Alex:

What do they call?

Max:

Bigger pockets?

Never heard of it.

David:

The guy might not have been published in the newest article there. Yeah, I know. I read the first three. Now. I'm probably gonna subscribe.

Max:

If you're looking for some kind of land investing specific real estate forum though. Ari tipster by Seth Williams is really good.

David:

I love Seth.

Max:

Yeah, he's really good in this space and has a lot of knowledge.

Alex:

I didn't know that about him. I don't know that much about Seth. But um, I met him a bunch of times.

45:00 - 47:59

David:

Seth, Lucas and I got lost in DC at fincon. Last year, it was good times

Alex:

When you figure out, when you’re at the conferences you are like, you know, Are you fun to drink with?

David:

Yeah, I like Seth for sure. Good people.

Alex:

Yeah.

David:

Alright, awesome. And then the other one would just be where can people get a hold of you guys?

Max:

Yeah, so people can get a hold of us all through our website or they can reach out to us via email. So if you send an email to us [email protected] and that's prycd.com that's that's an email that both Ryan and myself will get. But if you want to send us directly to us, that's more than awesome to do. We'll always reach back and respond to you and we can hop on zoom and talk a little bit more but my email is Max.Edson. So [email protected] and then Ryan's is [email protected] so those are the best emails you can reach back out to us. And we're always happy to partner up and collaborate or just talk and just help everyone learn the process and where we're at, what mistakes we've learned throughout the process and just talk it out.

David:

Awesome. Well, I really appreciate this. This was a lot of fun. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if you see me in there buying some names off your list and slamming some mailers into my market at some point to test the waters because it's, I've found it interesting. And you know, with the affordable price for some names. What do I have to lose?

So all that being said, I appreciate it guys, this has been fun. There's been a lot of good, good stuff. And I look forward to seeing where your platform grows in the next year to three when you know when when we can maybe like three years we can come back on and Alex is Lindy principle will seem nicer to you, be around for this long. Now we're gonna do that we're talking

Alex:

Show me back in my face, I love it.

Ryan:

Now he takes us seriously.

David:

Alex doesn't take anyone seriously. Himself included.

Max:

Awesome. Well, we appreciate you having us on the show too. Again, this is a great platform. We love what you're doing. And so we hope all other military members still invest in and kind of pursue their dreams and and kind of expand out and get those other reach outs and real estate's a great platform to create something with.

David:

I agree. Yeah, I enjoy some real estate for sure.

Awesome. Well, guys, I really appreciate it. And I'll let you know when this comes out. Thank you very much for being on the show.

Ryan:

Thank you.

Max:

Thank you.

End:

Thank you for listening to another episode about my journey From military to millionaire. If you liked it, be sure to visit Frommilitarytomillionaire.com/podcast to subscribe to future podcasts. While you're there, we'd love for you to rate the show. Give us a review on iTunes. Now get out there and take action.